Dear all,
| That Which is Perfect and Tongues General James Green I WOULD LIKE to present a thorough Bible study on the controversial subject of "speaking in other tongues" (Gk=Greek, glossolalia). The Bible tells us in 1 Thess. 5:21 to "prove all things; hold fast that which is good." By God's grace, I will endeavor to do this. I will prove that tongues have NOT passed away. I've been wanting to give an in-depth study on this subject for years. I did several tapes on "How the Gifts Ceased" years ago, but I have a greater knowledge now than I did 14 years ago. In a recent Christian (Lutheran) publication (Feb. 2005), there was an article written trying to tell the readers that "tongues have passed away." Such questions listed here followed the lengthy article: 1) Is this a supernatural phenomenon? 2) Is it an altered state of consciousness, a form of hypnosis or hysteria, or a process of learned behavior? 3) Is modern day glossolalia identical with the outpouring of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost? 4) Is it true that modern glossolalia is a spiritual and not a rational language? 5) Is glossolalia the "language of the angels?" 6) Is glossolalia a manifestation that one has received the Holy Spirit and a fulfillment of the Latter Rain promised in Joel 2:28,29? 7) Is glossolalia as practiced by Christians different from glossolalia practiced by non-Christians? 8) Is Christian usage of glossolalia from God or, as others hold, from Satan and connected with the demonic? 9) What are the results of the investigations done by linguists of various specialties concerning the similarities between Christian glossolalia and pagan glossolalia? 10) Where does "speaking in tongues" originate from? 11) Do all Christians need to "speak in tongues"? 12) Who endorses "speaking in tongues"? 13) Does "speaking in tongues" lead to a closer walk with Christ? 14) Is "speaking in tongues" the future means to unite all Christians into one single Church? All the above are good questions, and they can be answered. But, I want to concentrate on 1 Cor. 13:8-10 especially: "...whether there be tongues, they shall cease..." As there are dozens of books on the "tongues" and "Baptism of the Holy Spirit" subject, I suppose I will be addressing people who know of this phenomenon. Personally, I received the baptism of the Holy Ghost in 1971—along with my wife—and we were saved together. We've had the wonderful gift of tongues all this time, and we use our gift DAILY. But, also we do not belong to either a Pentecostal or a Charismatic Church. Our first five years of our Christian life in Christ, we did belong to a Pentecostal Organization. While studying for the ministry, we witnessed many miracles, and saw and experienced many manifestations of the Holy Spirit. Sadly, through the years, we've seen such foolishness enter into both the Pentecostal and Charismatic churches—whereby the Holy Spirit is mocked, abused, disobeyed, used etc...all in the name of "God." But, this should not discourage us from seeking the baptism of the Holy Spirit—with evidence of speaking in other tongues—nor should we get discouraged at the way the Word (the Bible) of God is mocked, abused, disobeyed, used etc. by non-Spirit-filled believers. To say the least, speaking in tongues has been manifested in nearly every Christian denomination up to this study (2005). Some estimate that between 140 to 380 million Christians engage in glossolalia worldwide. This ought to be alarming to the "unbelieving" believers that TONGUES HAS NOT CEASED AS THEY CLAIM...nor has the Bible ceased to be the final authority regarding the believer's path to righteousness. The numbers grow daily too. God wants His people to speak in His heavenly language; He wants His people to experience the miraculous. Sure there are abuses, even counterfeits, but isn't there the same thing out there: fake prophets, false teachers, fake shepherds etc.?—using the Bible to direct lambs and sheep into Hell!??? |
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Sent: Saturday, December 5, 2015 8:05 AM
Subject: [wanabidii] Re: The Cessation of the Gifts of Tongues, Prophecies and Knowledge.
Jagem
What you said has brought me to the book and film about exodus . When Moses crossed the so called red see towards Canaan. The book is very disturbing so is the film. Immediately Moses crossed the Red Sea he took his people across to his wife's home or village. The woman he married when he was chased away from Egyptian pharaoh 's home. After his hebrew blood secrete was exposed.
The truth is the woman Moses married was an Ethiopian lady whose father was a preacher in Ethiopia. Moses never had many wives. So please can somebody re draw the Red Sea map by then and today to tell us how one can cross it from Egypt and still end up in Ethiopia?. . Or which sea did Moses actually cross with his people?. Was Ethiopia by then in Asia ?.
History has taught us a lot . And one of the simplest thing I have learnt from history is that; it is written according to the conquerors will and wish. So all what comes behind or in addition are just modifications. Or just crocodile tears. In 20 years from now if nothing changes in Kenya. Kenyan history will be written by grabbers children. They are going to be so powerful that anything coming from a peasants mouth like me you etc will be of no interest to the common man. First they have an easy access to the press, they own them , they decide what to be read and stored in archive. They are the rulers and can still decide who rules after them unless a revolution takes place.
Paul the peasant.
Sent from my iPhone
Paul,I trust that you are an ardent believer of the scriptures. That i have no doubt. However, when you make reference to one Apostle Paul and quote the Books he wrote, I am left wondering as to what your message is.Apostle Paul was the biggest traitor to the word of Christ. He is the progenitor of Anti Christ. He is the man who dream t started and implemented Anti Christ movement. Why you find quoting this Traitor as a way to convince brethren towards embracing Christ is not very clear to me. Once a Traitor, always a traitor. There are somethings that run in the family blood and cannot be changed. For Example, In Kenya you have seen children born in the household of Grabbers and thieves, grow up and turn to be unspeakable grabbers and thieves themselves.This therefore shows you that Paul could not have been and shall never be the right person to quote in reference to Christ. He was the Originator of Anti Christ movement (Church)Follow the Link and listen to some of his lies through Pastor Ray Hagins.Jagem....On Fri, Dec 4, 2015 at 5:52 AM, Paul Liyai <pauliyai@yahoo.com> wrote:I would request those who would like to engage with me in this biblical debate to do so by employing both deductive and inductive reason when responding to my argument. I would prefer that before you disagree with me , please give evidence also by negating the scriptures I have put forth. The bible only says what it says and not what we think it says.I have been asked to answer a question first if tongues and prophecies failed.I would like to say that according to 1Corintians 13 8 Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whetherthere are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.Interpreting the verse above, using plenary hermeneutics, the verse says that LOVE IS ETERNAL. God cannot say something is forever when contrary is true. God is love and and God is The Truth. The Conjunction of contrast BUT in the sentence that begins with it.. but whether there are prophecies they will fail points to the fact there are two issues here being contrasted. These are love and prophesies.Prophecies here may mean the oracles or pronouncements themselves or the gifts of prophecy themselves. The later qualifies to be the best rendering that the former because love is not a pronouncement neither is it an oracle.So the direct translation of the the phrase fail is THEY-SHALL-BE-BEING-DOWN-UN-ACTED they-shall-be-being-discarded pointing to the fact that the gift of prophecy shall be progressively discarded. The word shall here is stronger than will pointing to the fact that it is imperative and future.The Greek word katarghqhsontai translated FAIL in some versions actually means discard or get rid of (someone or something) and the English Dictionary adds that it means get rid of something as no longer useful or desirable. In our daily lives we discard many things not necessarily because they are Bad, but because they are no longer useful or no longer fit in the present need. The synonyms for this word include: dispose of, throw away/out, get rid of, toss out, dispense with, cast aside/off, throw on the scrapheap; The above rendering should be applied to the following clauses whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away. ( εἴτε γλῶσσαι παύσονται ; εἴτεγνῶσις καταργηθήσεται) The words Cease and vanish are terminal in essence and they refer to the coming of an end in something. Webster's Dictionary defines these words thus: Cease =to bring an activity or action to an end : discontinue, obsolete : Vanish : to become extinct : die out., To pass out of existence ; to become zero.I personally believe that these three sign gifts are no longer in use today not because they are bad but because they are no longer needed. There are other gifts that have superseded them. A spiritual parallel to this perspective is the Coming of John the Baptist and the Coming of Jesus' ministry, the end of Jesus' earthly ministry and the advent of the Holy Spirit and the preaching of the gospel to the Gentiles. All these events NEVER HAPPENED SIMULTANEOUSLY. John the Baptist had to VANISH for Jesus to take over. Jesus Christ had to die on the Cross for the Holy Spirit, the Mighty Counselor to take control and empower the Church. God is a God of order and not of confusion. A contemporary analogy would be, the use of technology. If anyone wants to use any of these below, he has the liberty to do so but the the newer technology dictates the terms. You may insist on using any of the gadgets below but they are overtaken with time. So the alternative is for you to take the latest that can serve your need.The question is WHEN? When shall this gifts tongues, of prophecy and knowledge be discarded? Simple English Grammar tells us that the word will or shall used in a sentence points to the future. But when is this Future? The Bible is a good teacher. The Apostle Paul write in the 1Cor. 13 thatFor we know in part and we prophesy in part. 10 But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.The WE in the verses above refers to Paul and his contemporaries.The above analogy informs us that during the time of Paul and the other Apostles, they knew in part-that is to say the tongues they used then , the prophecy they had then and the knowledge they had at that time in terms of the sign gifts, were all IMPERFECT. Verse 10 points to that which is perfect. When that which is perfect has come, then that which is imperfect will disappear. So what is this PERFECT. Some theologians say that the perfect refers to the second coming of Christ but when Christ comes we do not need FAITH and HOPE. The Greek New Testament ICorinthians 13:10 reads as follows= ὅταν δὲ ἔλθῃ τὸ τέλειον τὸ ἐκ μέρους καταργηθήσεται ( hotan de elthe to teleion to ek merous katargesetai ) Which is translated as But whenthat which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.The best interpretation of these verse is to take the neuter gender that which which correctly refers to a thing, an understanding or a revelation rather than a the person of Jesus Christ. I believe what the Apostle Paul was referring to here in these verses was the PERFECT WORD OF GOD we call THE HOLY BIBLE. In this library of 66 books we have all the PERFECT TONGUES in the World, better and varied than the ones spoken at Pentecost. In the Bible we have all the PERFECT PROPHECIES fulfilled and unfilled. In the Bible we have all the PERFECT KNOWLEDGE. Therefore we do not need the three sign Gifts of tongues, prophecies and knowledge because they are obsolete. They vanished. They ceased they passed away. What people are doing now is just a sham. Remember I said that AT PRESENT WE HAVE NO SINGLE PROPHET OR APOSTLE IN THE ORDER OF THE BIBLICAL PROPHETS AND THE NEW TESTAMENT APOSTLES. I will address Ephesians 4 in the next blog. Otherwise I would like to end with the apostle Paul who summed up everything saying11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things. 12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.13 And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.--For that with me; for thou shall not FEAR Jachien.
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