Monday, 26 November 2012

Re: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus’ Date of Birth

Nimesema mara nyingi sasa kinachosemwa ni kuwa kuhusu siku hasa aliyozaliwa yesu yaweza isiwe hii tuliyozoea leo yaani kwamba alipozaliwa ndo inaanza mwaka moja.ukisoma tu vizuri injili na vitabu vya historia utaona mfano yesu anapozaliwa alitaka kuuawa na herode.lakini utawala wa herode haupo mwaka huo tunaposema yesu alizaliwa.inabidi turudi nyuma miaka kama 4+ ili tuishi wakati wa herode.jambo linafahamika mno kwa wanafunzi wa biblia.sasa mshtuko unatoka wapi! Ni kama siku zile papa alipoongelea matumizi ya kondom kwa mashoga na washenzi.kuna wengi walishtuka oooh papa kabadili mafundisho ya kanisa katoliki.lakini alichosema kiko kwenye katekisimu tangu miaka ya 80.bali ni njama za siku zote za wapinga ukatoliki.ukiona mpinzani wako anakwambia umefanya vizuri basi kuwa makini.si mnakumbuka john paul 2 alivonyimwa nobel eti kwa kuwa anapinga matumizi ya kondomu lakini haohao wakampa mama theresa tuzo.sasa mama tereza alikuwa anaunga mkono kondomu? Na tuwe makini basi
Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone on the Tigo Tanzania Network
From: Mobhare Matinyi <matinyi@hotmail.com>
Sender: wanabidii@googlegroups.com
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 16:27:06 +0000
To: Wanabidii googlegroups<wanabidii@googlegroups.com>
ReplyTo: wanabidii@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus' Date of Birth

Dkt. Kafumu,
Kumbe upo? Nimefarijika sana kusikia sauti yako. Usiwe unapotea namna hii, tafadhali.
Unaweza kutudokezea maendeleo ya ile taasisi adhimu ya madini kule Shinyanga?
Matinyi.
 
Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2012 08:10:41 -0800
From: kafumu@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus' Date of Birth
To: wanabidii@googlegroups.com

Kilasara.
 
Nimesoma maelezo yako kuhusu msimamo wa nbaba Mtakatifu juu ya siku ya X-mass, nikapata mshangao.
 
Wakati mwingine wanafalsafa kama ninyi ndiyo mnaowachanganya waumini (walei) wa kawaida kama sisi. Kubadilika kwa tarehe ya kusherehekea kuzaliwa kwa Yesu hakuwezi kubadilisha Msingi wa imani Katoliki kuwa Mungu kwa upendo wake mkuu aliumba viumbe vyote akiwemo binadamu ili washiriki uhai wake. Tena kwa upendo Yeye aliyekuwepo, aliyepo na atakayekuwepo, wakati ulipotimia, binadamu alipokosa aliamua Yeye mwenyewe Yehovah kuwa kama sisi akakaa nasi kutuonesha njia iendayo kwake Mwenyewe. Katika Nafsi ya Yesu Kristo Emanuel Mungu pamoja nasi alitukomboa.
 
 Akaendelea na anaendelea kukaa nasi hadi ukamilifu wa dahari katika Roho wake Mtakatifu (nafsi yake) Yeye Mungu Mwenye Enzi... Kusherehekea hata kuwa na maono tofauti kuhusu tarehe ya Kuzaliwa Mungu Mwana (Mkombozi) hakubadilishi ukweli wa ukombozi wetu..
 
La msingi tumekombolewa na twawajibika kuishi maisha ya Imani kwenda mbinguni. Tarehe ya kuzaliwa, kusulubiwa na kufa msalabani, na hata kufufuka, haviondoi Imani na ukweli wa mpango wa Mungu. Anayekosa Imani kwa sababu ya tarehe hizo hamjui Yesu kuwa  ni Bwana na Mwokozi wa maisha yake.
 
Tuwafundishe watu kumjua Yesu Ksisto, Alfa na Omega, Mwanzo na Mwisho, Neno wa Mungu, Emmanuel, Mungu Pamoja nasi na Mungu kweli, badala ya kulumbana kuhusu historia,,,
 
Mungu awabariki
 
Ngw'izukulushilinde
 


--- On Mon, 11/26/12, Kilasara Fratern <kilasara.fratern@gmail.com> wrote:

From: Kilasara Fratern <kilasara.fratern@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus' Date of Birth
To: wanabidii@googlegroups.com
Date: Monday, November 26, 2012, 10:01 AM

For the sake of 'peace and tranquility of the Catholic Doctrines' that is why I said, this discourse is uncalled for, as it can degenerate and spill a discussion, which the Church itself cannot defend.

There are things in the Church that are not discussable, and if we so do, "kila mtu atatokea dirishani, na tunayoyaona Ulaya leo hii makanisa yako tupu, tunawashangaa kuwa hawana 'akili'; yatatukuta, na hakutakuwa na wakumshangaa mwingine. Mambo ya Imani yanapaswa kuchukuliwa kwa Imana hivyo hivyo, na tusipende kuingiza akili nyingi (yaana Falsafa) kwenye mambo ya imani; maana kwenye imani, kuna mambo ambayo hayajibiki kwa akili ya kawaida, na hapa ndipo tunapomhitaji Roho Mtakatifu atufundishe, atufunulie, na kutuongoza.

Ndio maana msimamo wa Baba Mtakatifu, japo mimi ni muumini wake (niliyekuzwa na mfumo wake wa malezi), lakini nadiriki kutoa angalizo lililotangulia kuwa mjadala unaoweza kuibuliwa na mada iliyoko kwenye kitabu chake unaweza kuwachanganya waumini wa kawaida kuliko kuwajenga i.e. Theological positions and counter-positions, ambayo hii ndio kiini cha wimbi la makanisa mengi siku hizi kuibuka na kalenda zao tofauti za kuadhimisha sikukuu za Pasaka na Noeli; hili ndio limbuko lake. Kwenye imani, hakuna kitu hatari kwa muumini wa kawaida kama 'mafundisho tata!' Muumini wa kawaida anataka kuambiwa, ukweli na uongo ni huu, na sio, 'something in between,  the "either...or" situation, which is a preserve for the Philosophers and Theologians.

Sorry friends, I got to end here, but let us take whatever is being said with caution because my worry is 'the message' that is being sent to the lay people and the motive behind this discourse? Can we say, the intention of the Holy Father, in future is to come up with a proposal to change the date of the Christmas eve? Otherwise, what is the intention of reviving this discourse this time around although for those of us trained in the Catholic circles, knows quite well that this is something that has existed in the Catholic circles (i.e. Philosophers and Theologians alike) for many years?

I proclaim my mouth short, from now on as far as this matter is concern, lest I am pronounced 'anathema cit!'

Thank you,

Kilasara.

On Sun, Nov 25, 2012 at 10:22 AM, Emmanuel Mkolokoti <Emmanuel.Mkolokoti@lsg.co.tz> wrote:
Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone from Vodacom Tanzania
From: Kilasara Fratern <kilasara.fratern@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2012 00:25:18 +0300
Subject: Re: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus' Date of Birth

This is a good description for the 'historians' but for the 'innocent' faithful, I am afraid, it might end up confusing them; particularly, the last section, with the use of the word 'myth' being referred in the "Nativity Discourse."

Now, it is time for the Church leaders to refrain from getting involved in discourses that are likely to confuse the faithful and instead 'keep it simple.' Too much philosophy and theological positions and counter-positions in our RC doctrines, that sometimes one feels lost in the middle of no where! Is there a way to keep it simple, in that, by focusing on the direct meaning revealed to us in the first encounter when we read the Bible for example than the ex-scatological meaning?

For example, right now, as a believer, what is important is not the exact date when Jesus was born but, the fact that it is true that the Jesus we are talking about is real, He was born, and He lived in this world not only as a man but as the true Son of God and that today, the Jesus I encounter is the same throughout the ages, then, now, and in future. How do we enunciate the Living Jesus Christ into the lives of our faithful so that they not only experience Him in their lives but He actually leads their Spiritual Life? This is what the Church ought to do, but I am not sure on how best?

Kilasara.



On Sat, Nov 24, 2012 at 7:04 PM, <josephludovick@gmail.com> wrote:
Oooh that may be interesting to many even suprising to some.the pope in his intellectual luminary has given us a food. Yes the food for the intellect. Thank you holy father to still duc in ultum.
Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone from Vodacom Tanzania
Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2012 10:49:27 -0500
Subject: Re: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus' Date of Birth

The Pope is addressibg the year not the day and month. He may be right.
Matinyi.

T-Mobile. America's First Nationwide 4G Network

----- Reply message -----
From: "Pauline Mengi" <paulinemengi@gmail.com>
To: "Wanabidii" <wanabidii@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [wanabidii] Pope Benedict Disputes Jesus' Date of Birth
Date: Sat, Nov 24, 2012 7:00 am


Pope Benedict XVI has revealed in the third installment of his
trilogy, dedicated to the life of Christ, that Jesus may have been
born earlier than previously thought. The calendar we use today, which
commences with the birth of Christ and was created by a Dionysius
Exiguus, a 6th century monk, may be mistaken. According to the
Telegraph, the Pope explains in his book that Exiguus, who is
considered the inventor of the Christian calendar, "made a mistake in
his calculations by several years. The actual date of Jesus' birth was
several years before." The suggestion that Jesus wasn't actually born
on Dec. 25 has been tirelessly debated by theologians, historians and
spiritual leaders, but what makes this case different is that now the
leader of the Catholic Church is the one asking the questions.

Pope Benedict's book, Jesus of Nazareth: The Infancy Narratives, was
published on Tuesday. Like the previous two installments, it's
predicted to be a best seller, and a million copies of the book have
already been printed. It is expected that the book will be translated
into another 20 languages for publication in 72 countries. The Infancy
Narratives follows the life of Jesus from conception to his
presentation in the temple at the age of 12. The Pope describes this
third book as a "small antechamber" to the trilogy on Jesus of
Nazareth, reports the Vatican Press Office.

(MORE: Holy Hashtags! The Pope Will Soon Join the Tweeting Masses)

Pope Benedict makes some controversial statements in the book. He
writes of how the Gospel of Matthew claims that Jesus was born when
Herod the Great ruled in Judea. However, given that Herod died in 4
B.C., Jesus must have been born earlier than Exiguus originally
documented. Arguments surrounding Jesus' exact date of birth have
confounded scholars for centuries. Even the Gospel of Luke contends
that the birth took place when Quirinius was governor of Syria in A.D.
6.

The author takes the opportunity not only to dispute the date of
Jesus' birth, but also to reaffirm the doctrine of the virgin birth as
an "unequivocal" truth of faith. Reuters writes that Benedict reminds
his readers that sexual intercourse did not play a part in the
conception of Jesus. He states that a belief in the virgin birth of
Christ is a "cornerstone of faith" and a sign of "God's creative
power." "If God does not also have power over matter, then he simply
is not God," the Pope argues. "But he does have this power, and
through the conception and resurrection of Jesus Christ he has ushered
in a new creation."

Pope Benedict also examines the "question of interpreted history,"
referring in particular to the attempts of the Gospels, like those of
Matthew and Luke, to make sense of events after they had occurred,
notes Reuters. "The aim of the evangelists was not to produce an
exhaustive account," the Pope explains, "but a record of what seemed
important for the nascent faith community in the light of the word.
The infancy narratives are interpreted history, condensed and written
down in accordance with the interpretation."

(MORE: Why Popes Never Have to Say Sorry)

There have been countless interpretations of the birth, life and death
of Christ throughout history. One such interpreter is Bill Darlison,
former Unitarian Church minister and current vice president of the
General Assembly of Unitarian and Free Christian Churches in the
United Kingdom. Like others before him, he asks whether Christ was
actually born on Dec. 25 or whether perhaps he was born "on one of
about 150 other dates which have been proposed down through the
centuries. Was he born in Nazareth or in Bethlehem and, if Bethlehem,
was it Bethlehem in Judea or Bethlehem in Galilee?" He also argues
that the spiritual birth "is always a virgin birth, because it is not
related in any sense (except symbolically) to physical birth." In
2004, TIME asked the same question, with David Van Biema wondering if
"one might be tempted to abandon the whole Nativity story as
'unhistoric,' mere theological backing and filling."

The historical revisionism continues with the Pope raising the issue
of the presence of animals at the birth of Christ. He reveals in Jesus
of Nazareth that "there is no mention of animals in the Gospels." This
may come as a shock to the thousands of schools currently preparing
their Nativity plays. But Pope Benedict reassures his readers not to
worry — that "no one will give up the oxen and the donkey in their
Nativity scenes," notes the Telegraph. Even if animals did not feature
at the birth, the Vatican seems happy to keep up the myth as it
presents an elaborate life-size Nativity scene in St. Peter's Square
this Christmas.

Jesus of Nazareth: The Infancy Narratives is available in English and
published by Image Books. It follows the first two books, which dealt
with Christ's adult life and death.

This article has been amended. The original version referred to the
conception of Jesus as "the Immaculate Conception." The term refers to
the life of Mary, mother of Jesus.

Read more: http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/11/22/pope-benedict-disputes-jesus-date-of-birth/#ixzz2D8mErZUX

--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com

DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30

80 GB HardDisk
CORE 2 DUO
2.0 GHZ CPU
2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW
WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP
WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .

TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY

CALL : 0718 637905
0786 806028

Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com  Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma

Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.



--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com
 
DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30
 
80 GB HardDisk
CORE 2 DUO
2.0 GHZ CPU
2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW
WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP
WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .
 
TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY
 
CALL : 0718 637905
0786 806028
 
Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma
 
Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.
 
 
--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com
 
DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30
 
80 GB HardDisk
CORE 2 DUO
2.0 GHZ CPU
2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW
WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP
WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .
 
TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY
 
CALL : 0718 637905
0786 806028
 
Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma
 
Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.
 
 



--
Fratern Kilasara,
P. O. Box - (Home): 62810; or (Office): 65300
Dar es Salaam - Tanzania.
Telephone (Office): +255 (0)22 2700021/4 Ext No. 239; Fax: +255 (0)22 2775591
Mobile (Personal): +255 (0)715 40 41 53 or +255 (0)754 40 41 53
Emails: kilasara.fratern@gmail.com or kilasara.fratern@yahoo.com

--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com
 
DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30
 
80 GB HardDisk
CORE 2 DUO
2.0 GHZ CPU
2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW
WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP
WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .
 
TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY
 
CALL : 0718 637905
0786 806028
 
Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma
 
Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.
 
 
--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com
 
DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30
 
80 GB HardDisk
CORE 2 DUO
2.0 GHZ CPU
2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW
WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP
WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .
 
TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY
 
CALL : 0718 637905
0786 806028
 
Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma
 
Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.
 
 



--
Fratern Kilasara,
P. O. Box - (Home): 62810; or (Office): 65300
Dar es Salaam - Tanzania.
Telephone (Office): +255 (0)22 2700021/4 Ext No. 239; Fax: +255 (0)22 2775591
Mobile (Personal): +255 (0)715 40 41 53 or +255 (0)754 40 41 53
Emails: kilasara.fratern@gmail.com or kilasara.fratern@yahoo.com

--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com
 
DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30
 
80 GB HardDisk
CORE 2 DUO
2.0 GHZ CPU
2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW
WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP
WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .
 
TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY
 
CALL : 0718 637905
0786 806028
 
Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma
 
Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.
 
 

--
Jobs in Africa - www.wejobs.blogspot.com
nafasi mpya za Kazi www.kazibongo.blogspot.com
Habari na Picha www.patahabari.blogspot.com
 
DELL LATITUDE D 620 & D30
 
80 GB HardDisk ,CORE 2 DUO , 2.0 GHZ CPU ,2 GB RAM
DVD/CD - RW ,WINDOWS 7 /WINDOWS XP ,WIRELESS , BLUE TOOTH .
 
TSHS : 380,000 , 1 YEAR WARRANTY
 
CALL : 0786 806028
Free Delivery in Dar es salaam
 
Kujiondoa Tuma Email kwenda
wanabidii+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com Utapata Email ya kudhibitisha ukishatuma
 
Disclaimer:
Everyone posting to this Forum bears the sole responsibility for any legal consequences of his or her postings, and hence statements and facts must be presented responsibly. Your continued membership signifies that you agree to this disclaimer and pledge to abide by our Rules and Guidelines.
 
 
Posted by at

0 comments:

Post a Comment

Subscribe to: Post Comments (Atom)